Sunday, August 23, 2009

Outliers. Have you gotten your 10,000 hours in?

Two posts ago, I remarked that it was a bit shocking that not many coaches actively scoop-up post-college athletes. In other words, we, in the US, tend to be hyper focused on discovering the next Suleymonglu at the age of 12; to the point, that taking on an athlete over the age of 17 or even 20 seemed to be a waste of time.

So, interestingly, I was on a business trip to Canada (not shoes, my real job), and upon watching some CBC, I came across a review of the book "Outliers", fascinated by its propositions on successful athletes, I started reading it.

In a nutshell...

In order to be an extraordinarily successful athlete, you need opportunity and 10,000 hours--or 10 years- of serious practice. In other words, no one is a success on their own. Not even the most physically gifted people can wake-up, one day, and just clean and jerk triple their bodyweight.

Even more importantly, factual case studies show that one only needs a minimal level of talent to become, say, Olympic Champion. What makes one greater than competitors is the amount of additional work and practice you have had. In sports, music, business, or academia, their are thousands, millions of talented people; the difference between mediocre, good, and great is the great people had unique opportunities that allowed them to put in the 10,000 hours to be the best.

How this relates to lifting

When it comes to "talent identification" it is more important that our lifters are able to put in the thousands of hours of work to be successful. Per Popov's comments in Bulgaria --- all you need to be a good lifter is (1) the ability to do a full squat, (2) rack a bar in a clean, (3) ability to do an overhead squat--- the rest is a function of who has the opportunity and desire to put in the 10000 hours or roughly ten years of hard training.

Playing Devils advocate

Every once in while, there is a track athlete, that seemingly comes out of no where and wins a National weightlifting meet.
Is it because they are so much more talented and gifted than any lifter currently in the system ? No. It's probably because they are already elite athlete's in an explosive sport, having incorporated Olympic lifting movements as part of their normal training.

Samething with Junior lifters: Why are some early or late bloomers? Adolescents hit puberty at different points, and some children have been doing other sports since they were toddlers. Some have very sport-focused, supportive parents.

Overall, its accumulative advantage or disadvantage that adds-up overtime. It might not seem like such a big deal, but it is over an athlete's lifetime.

Conclusion
If we want to be a power, again, in weightlifting, the most important step is to set-up infrastructure where athletes can train consistently, and support athletes who, after given the opportunity to train, continue to put in the hour. Consistent, hard training is paramount above all other factors-- age, perceived talent, etc.

Hmmm, the above is exactly how the Colombian selection system works. Lifters who train hard and meet minimal qualifiers are rewarded, supported, and incentivized to keep training.

Horatio Alger, go home!

References:
Gladwell, Malcom. Outliers. 2008. Hatchette Book Group: New York, NY.

16 comments:

Barry said...

I read this book also Gwen, it is fascinating and it really does correlate to weightlifting, and most activities. With my spending between ten and twelve hours a week in the gym on average-- more when I am on school hoildays-- the 10, 000 hour rule is a bit of a pipe dream.

However, mindful practice and thinking outside the box can go a long way too, so maybe we have a chance!

gwen said...

Well, the positive part is that training is cumulative. It will just take longer.

Anonymous said...

Errrrr, I disagree ; the reward system in america isnt in place; never has been , never will be. Go ask Norb about his years. All of the good OL prospects go into football, wrestling, some track .

gwen said...

Exactly, I agree. Americans, on average, simply do not train enough. Without a reward system, weightlifting can seem like a thankless, brutal sport.

I contrast, there is some reward system in track - college scholarships, endorsements, and we fare much better in the Olympics, likewise.

Norb Schemansky is a weightlifting hero. Look at over how many years he lifted and how great he became. Easily he would have clocked over 10K hours. I think what you are bringing up is whether all the trainign was worth it as he did not get hefty rewards like swimmers or track stars...thats a different point

Anonymous said...

Americans have this conceit that if we're not good at something, it's because we don't want to or aren't trying to be. This sort of talk is very unsportsmanlike. I think America has cultivated a distorted view of itself ever since it reached a historical apex in the 1950's, a time when the rest of the world was still recovering from global war or else freeing itself from colonial bondage. Those times are fading fast, and in a world of almost 6,707 million people 304 million Americans can't expect to come out on top in every field of endeavor.

In the 1950's, the U.S. contributed roughly half the world's GDP; today, that percent has dropped below 30%. Weightlifting, unlike many other sports, doesn't require a lot of money to train. America's top weightlifters do train hard, and our elite weightlifters throw up mind-boggling amounts of weight. Give credit where credit is due: the world's top elite weightlifters are both highly talented and highly trained.

Statistically speaking, Americans haven't been doing so badly at weightlifting in the Olympics. Since 2000, we've had one gold medalist (Tara Notts). So out of roughly 45 gold medals handed out since then, we've won one. If we had won one more gold, we would have had 2 golds out of 45 total gold medals, a ratio equivalent to our proportion of world population. Given these numbers, I seriously doubt that any program, short of Super Vitamin S, will significantly boost our chances of medaling in weightlifting at the Olympics.

Shaun LC said...

Great topic Gwen!

Gwen wrote: "Even more importantly, factual case studies show that one only needs a minimal level of talent"

The way you have written this, Gwen, it would seem that you are saying that only a small amount of talent is necessary.

The author of the book was actually arguing that one only has to be "good enough" - and I suspect that talent threshold is not commonly met by the average person.

Unknown said...

Gwen,
You are spot on right.

Great points that many of us don't think about when we wondered how Bill Gates became Bill Gates.

See you down the road.

Mark

Nick Horton said...

Great post Gwen,

I am a weightlifting coach in Portland, Oregon. My club is only 3 years old, but I've got a number of great lifters. NONE of them are under 20 years old. 2 are over 40, I'm in my 30's, and some of my toughest are in their late 20's.

I agree that many coaches obsess about youth. Well ... we aren't going to get a bunch of kids in weightlifting the way gymnastics does. I'm not convinced that will ever happen. And personally, I don't care.

Like you said, put in 10 solid years of lifting, and you'll be a powerhouse. Maybe you won't be an Olympian, maybe you will. But, regardless, you'll be amazing.

If you start at 25, then at 35 you'll be remarkable. Age is important. But, it isn't THAT important. Maturity is the real issue, and older athletes have it.

Maturity causes you to stick to your training when it gets tough, when you're sick, when you're bored, when you want to give up. YOu made a commitment to the sport, and you're going to keep it. That's the kind of maturity a 12 year old doesn't have, but a 25 year old does.

Nick Horton,
www.TheIronSamurai.com

PS. I recently bought a pair of Risto shoes (Red), and I LOVE them. Been wearing them for about 4 months now, and I've competed in them twice. I can't praise them enough.

Anonymous said...

Hello all
http://www.printhousesigns.com/ - cheap propecia online
I am sure that you will be benefited.
[url=http://www.printhousesigns.com/]generic propecia online[/url]

Till now no major side effects of Propecia is known.
propecia drug
S.

Anonymous said...

Hi,
Best Online Casinos

There is a plethora of gambling sites to select from.
[url=http://nicheblogssquad.com/]Online Casinos[/url]

For choosing a website to get started with your online gambling experience you need to conduct a mere research.
http://nicheblogssquad.com/ - Online Casinos
The online casinos offer you almost each and every game that you can enjoy in a regular casino.

Anonymous said...

free car facts vin
winter emergency kit for the car
advantage car hire
car maxford mustangs
lambskin car coat
amman car rental
vigilance for driver in car
three wheel car auto

Anonymous said...

Worldwide mankind and impair communication [url=http://onlineviagrapill.com]viagra[/url]. Our tolerating online medicament pharmacopoeia [url=http://ambiendrug.com]ambien[/url].

Anonymous said...

http://markonzo.edu luzuriaga http://riderx.info/members/biaxin-side-effects.aspx http://profiles.friendster.com/neurontin#moreabout http://profiles.friendster.com/crestore#moreabout superiors

Anonymous said...

DfiAJj penegra visa/mastercard/amex/echeck XFVhVT plavix world delivery ymgqPw mentax 10mg IjKznZ inderal world shipping KWWZCl trimox order UupZnm exelon now ashbPa urispas world delivery

Anonymous said...

hJ8ujZI3YD Casino 5 9pRVZ0STB Casino Soft 0kaeojqp7 Peppermill Hotel Casino 5mE6ZUWc1 Acoustic Alchemy Casino lhbCD4PIMc Casino Arizona uR08ajXJd Casino Operations TVWn10KlsG Las Vegas Casinos altsZqBox Comps

Anonymous said...

Amiable dispatch and this enter helped me alot in my college assignement. Gratefulness you seeking your information.

Lifting in Kazakhstan, Temirtau, Ilyin's former gym

Lifting in Kazakhstan, Temirtau, Ilyin's former gym
In Temirtau, Kazakhstan. Still, unable to do any overhead work from a ligament tear, I'm just rehabbing with pulls to retrain my muscles. Training next to me is the Youth and Junior team of Temirtau. Ilya Ilyin used to train in this facility as a junior. As well as a recent Junior World Champion, Maksim

Snatching 92kg at the Risto Olympia Cup

Snatching 92kg at the Risto Olympia Cup
This was the 2nd highest snatch in all of the USA for 2014 in official competition for women's 69kg weight class. The only athlete to snatch higher was Jenny Arthur with 98kg. At the time, she was lifting for USAW weightlifting club Risto Team.

Oscar Figueroa,Olympic Silver Medalist, World medalist 2009

Oscar Figueroa,Olympic Silver  Medalist, World medalist 2009
Pictured at Salitre with Oscar Figueroa in center.

Popular Posts

Carlos Andica training with Coach Ivan

Carlos Andica training with Coach Ivan

Arnold, Carlos & Joni Andica

Arnold, Carlos & Joni Andica
Right before Coach Ivan consulted Carlos for the 2011 Pan AM Games, where he broke a Pan AM record. These guys were unofficially competing for Risto Team at the 2011 Arnold.

Shoe porn

Shoe porn
Russian boots, classic weightlifting shoes with modern shoe technology. Exquisite full leather upper, wood heel, rawhide forefoot, natural rubber outsole. One of a kind.

Documenting history of singlets

Documenting history of singlets
USAW national team member in Risto Singlet

Ivan in the Warm-up room with the Andica Brothers

Ivan in the Warm-up room with the Andica Brothers

Leidy Solis- PAN AM Champion 2009

Leidy Solis- PAN AM Champion 2009
Leidy in winning form, she's wearing risto weightlifting shoes. Congratulations Leidy!

Exceeding expectations -Archive

Exceeding expectations -Archive
Classic weightliftng shoe design with modern accents. These were produced by Risto Sports

In Iceland

In Iceland

Coach Jonny Pan AM champ

Coach Jonny Pan AM champ
Afternoon coach, doing pwr cleans while his lifters finish up

shoeporn

shoeporn
note pawprints

Abs

Abs
More on Facebook

Shoeporn-Custom Weightlifting shoe history

Shoeporn-Custom Weightlifting shoe history

Documenting shoe history

Documenting shoe history
first commercial shoe marketed to youth sizes

Bucharest Training Center

Bucharest Training Center
Ramanian Coach Doru, Ivan, Romanian Lifter Eiza

Nikolai Stoichkov- JR Bulgarian Lifter, son of Zdravco Stoichkov

Nikolai Stoichkov- JR Bulgarian Lifter, son of Zdravco Stoichkov
Training with a pair of Botev shoes. These shoes take a beating of 18000 to 20000 reps per year and heavy loads 90-100% - Also known as the Bulgarian system.

sweet singlet

sweet singlet

Future Champion- Tough lifters wear pink!

Future Champion- Tough lifters wear pink!
Gwendolyn Rojas getting ready to snatch 60kgs at 20kg bodyweight and 4 years old.

Stoichkov in Action

Stoichkov in Action
Coach Stoichkov adjusting my starting position.

Ivan giving training advice in Frankfurt Oder

Ivan giving training advice in Frankfurt Oder
Here Ivan, as a coach, is giving lifting advice to German Junior lifters at the Olympic Training Center in Frankfurt Oder, Germany. Yes, Ivan is fluent in German and is speaking German to the lifters.

Working out with the Champs

Working out with the Champs
Gwen squatting wth Georgiev, Peschalov, and new lifter in background

Training in Bulgaria - Gwen and Coach Zdravco Stoichov

Training in Bulgaria - Gwen and Coach Zdravco Stoichov
Stoichov is coach of Peschalov, Georgiev, etc. Also of key interest: Similar to USA lifters missing out on their chance to medal at the 1980 Olympics , at the time of the boycotted '84 Olympic Games, Stoichkov outlifted the LA Games Gold Medalist at the Friendship Games/ Druzhba Games. The Druzhba Games were held in 1984 by Eastern bloc countries not participating in LA.

Ivan with Nikolai Gergov, Bulgarian Wrestling Champion

Ivan with Nikolai Gergov, Bulgarian Wrestling Champion
Ivan with the Greco wrestling world champ, Nikolai Gergov, after their workout. I still think its uncanny how elite athletes from multiple sports would just show up at Slavia for a workout (....and atleast one ask for lifting advice). Again, overall, Bulgarian athletes were humble or, rather, didn't "have an attitude" in the gym.

Gewichtheben - training at the German Olympic training center in Frankfurt am der Oder

Gewichtheben - training at the German Olympic training center in Frankfurt am der Oder
Me with the German Junior Team and Coach/German Olympian Lars Betker

Documenting shoe history: Coach Burgener Shoe

Documenting shoe history: Coach Burgener Shoe
A wonderfully patriotic, Americana themed shoe and T-shirt. GO USA!!!

Gwen posing with Peschalov

Gwen posing with Peschalov

Stoichkov during competitive years

Stoichkov during competitive years
Vintage photo of Stoichkov winning international Championship

Rumy, Bulgarian lifter

Rumy, Bulgarian lifter
Rumy,75kg lifter, stops by for a light workout in Slavia, Bulgaria

Botev stops by Slavia

Botev stops by Slavia
Gwen, Stefan Botev (multi-time Olympic Medalist and world champion), and Ivan

Gwen with Power Clean/slpit jerk with 80kg

Gwen with Power Clean/slpit jerk with 80kg
First workout in Slavia.

Size perspective for youtube video

Size perspective for youtube video
In Beijing, junior lifter

Ivan and Eric, the speedskater

Ivan and Eric, the speedskater
After a hard work out, Ivan and Eric go summertime cycling in Maine. Eric is a competitive Speedskater and a proud owner of weightlifting shoes. Ahhh ...nothing like summers in Maine!!

Stefan Georgiev

Stefan Georgiev
World and European Champion, 62kg. Rooting for him to medal in the 2008 Olympic Games!

Hanging out with Weighlifting heroes

Hanging out with Weighlifting heroes
Peschalov, Stoichov, self, and husband

Old Stuff - shoe porn

Old Stuff - shoe porn

Peschalov and Coach

Peschalov and Coach
Peschalov trained with Stoichkov leading up to his Gold medal win in 2000 Olympic Games

Training in Kennedy, Bogota

Training in Kennedy, Bogota

Euvgeni Popov, Stoichov, and Gwen

Euvgeni Popov, Stoichov, and Gwen
Popov - 1980's Bulgarian weightlifting team, also accomplished power lifter and strongman competitor.

Beijing - Gongti Area

Beijing - Gongti Area
Gwen lifting at second training location in Beijing near Workers Stadium, Gongti

Sylvia, Bulgarian Junior lifter, wearing Botev shoes

Sylvia, Bulgarian Junior lifter, wearing Botev shoes
Schoolage Champ, one of Stoichov's newer lifters. Sylvia also trains in Botev shoes. Her pair is also several years old and has lasted over 18K reps per year!

Romania - Training Center in Bucharest

Romania - Training Center in Bucharest
Me trining with Romanian lifters in Bucharest. Former USAW National Coach, Dragomir Ciroslan, had once lifted in this gym.

Wrestling World Champion (Greco) Nikolay Gergov working out in Slavia (BG), me in background

Wrestling World Champion (Greco) Nikolay Gergov working out in Slavia (BG), me in background
Nikolay Gergov is a Bulgarian Wrestling World Champion - Greco Roman 66kg category. Nikolai is already naemd to the 2008 Bulgarian Olympic Team. He is also competing at a meet at the Colorado Springs US OTC later this month (FEB 08). Anyhow, Nikolai just stops by for a workout in Slavia. He saw Ivan and I working out and asked Ivan for some technique coaching.

Gwen with Chinese coach of junior team at Chaoyang Ti Yu Chang (Beijing)

Gwen with Chinese coach of junior team at Chaoyang Ti Yu Chang (Beijing)
The coach pictured with me had won a gold medal in the snatch lifting against Karolina Lundhal (world champion) at the 1998 Worlds in Finland in 75Kg class.

Lifters in Bucharest

Lifters in Bucharest

Ivan with Coach Chiu, gongti area Beijing

Ivan with Coach Chiu, gongti area Beijing
After discussion of Chinese pull technique. Chiu is a former Junior World Champion.

Good Leather Smells good

Good Leather Smells good
Really, this was a Candid photo..."wow, this smells good"

Ivan Lifting in China - 2006

Ivan Lifting in China - 2006
Chinese training center, Chao Yang Ti Yu Chang in Beijing, a JR team pictured in background

Choayang Ti Yu Chang - Ivan with chinese junior lifters

Choayang Ti Yu Chang - Ivan with chinese junior lifters

Abigail Guererro, Almerimar, Spain 2004

Abigail Guererro, Almerimar, Spain 2004
In forefront, Abigail , who has been on the Spanish National Team, with teammates in background.

Me with Blessed Udoh, in Spain (DEC 2004)

Me with Blessed Udoh, in Spain (DEC 2004)
Blessed won the silver medal in 48kg at the 2001 World Championships representing Nigeria. She also trained in Bulgaria for the 2004 Olympics. Sadly to report that she died in Nigeria, last year.

Gwen lifting at Chaoyang Ti Yu Chang - Beijing,

Gwen lifting at  Chaoyang Ti Yu Chang - Beijing,
In Beijing, Chinese Juniors in background. Great kids, good sense of humor, listened to their formal coaches

Spain- Ivan and Miguel Borrazas

Spain- Ivan and Miguel Borrazas
Our good friend Miguel has coached Spain's national team.

Training Bogota

Training Bogota

Ivan with Coach Ediberto Barbosa, fmr Col natl team

Ivan with Coach Ediberto Barbosa, fmr  Col natl team

Mock Competition in Bogota

Mock Competition in Bogota
Gwen out snatches the challenger

Rick Bucinell, breaking master world record

Rick Bucinell, breaking master world record

Ivan arm wrestling Peschalov

Ivan arm wrestling Peschalov
My husband "attempting" to arm wrestle Peschalov with his good arm. Ivan remarked "Wow, he's strong..he was really trying to arm wrestle me" ..no kidding ....ha ha ha

Stuff you need to compete

Stuff you need to compete
Belts, singlets, knee and wrist wraps.

Little Gwen doing workout with new lifters

Little Gwen doing workout with new lifters

Me on Team USA which was sponsored by Risto Sports, 2010 University World Championships

Me on Team USA which was sponsored by Risto Sports, 2010 University World Championships
Me lifting for Team USA. We won 15 medals, Ivan was Assistant Coach to Team USA. We had no official uniforms-- until, THANKFULLY, Risto Sports donated gear such as USA polos and t-shirts, so we could at least match in some semblance of a uniform. The team got to represent our country well!

Tanya Morillas - 2004 in Spain

Tanya Morillas - 2004 in Spain
Training session at Almerimar. Subsequently, Tanya has been on Spanish national teams.

Dare Alabi , 77kg lifter (Nigeria)

Dare Alabi , 77kg lifter (Nigeria)
Nigerian lifter, Dare, lifting in Spain

warming up power cleans

warming up power cleans
Me training in Bogota Colombia